We've found a systematic pathway, which is great. So you gave us some great tips for polishing the resume, and in moving into building your personal network that you're going to need. And then self-marketing yourself through your network, as well as through social media. And so, if a student has progressed through that properly and successfully, now they have been granted an interview. What is your recommendations for number one, preparing for the interview, and then number two, delivering the interview? >> I'm going to do about a 90 degree twist on those questions if I can. >> Yes. >> Let's take the table, and help you understand what the people on the other side are looking for. >> Excellent. >> And I know we had a conversation, John and I did last week, and his saying is basically, what are you going to do, outstanding for me first day, first week, I've forgotten. >> First day. You've gotta be able to hit the ground running. So just as a recap, when I was hiring. I was a hiring manager, and I was hiring individuals. I'm looking for a few key things. Number one, first question I'm going to ask you, what do you know about the institution or corporation? I want to understand whether or not you've done your research well. There's a lot of public information that's free. Secondly, it doesn't hurt to call some one in the department, on the Internet, you have most people's telephone number. Call them. Hey, sir/ma'am, can I ask you a few questions about your company, I'm potentially going to be a future employee of your company. So, I'm going to ask you, what do you know about the company? >> Mm-hm. >> Number two, give me an assessment of your strengths. >> Mm-hm. >> After you give me an assessment of your strengths, since you already know about the company. How can you make this institution better? >> Mm-hm. >> Based upon what you know, and your strengths. How are you making it better? Where do you see this company needs to go in the future? What are we doing well? What are we doing not so well? And the things that we're doing not so well, do you see yourself as being immediate impact to help us solve those problems, or either progress positively and successful in the future? If you can't answer those questions then you are of no asset to the corporation. >> What you heard John do there is put you on the spot to come to a conclusion. [COUGH] To make a recommendation, realizing you gotta hedge it a little bit while based upon what I know, or you know here's what it looks like based upon my research. And it's critical to have done that research. >> Uh-huh. >> But the way you're going to be judged is really on three things. And this is from talking a lot of executive recruiters who are friends of mine. Number one is, do they believe that you can do the job you're being hired to do? And that comes back to who's going to hire me? What are they going to hire me to do? And does that fit make sense, and there may be ten things they need you to do. There'll be a primary two or three. Those you gotta be able to do. You're going to learn eight, nine, ten, but you gotta be able to do the core things. So, can they do the job? And this is assessment not fact. Second thing is, are you going to like doing this job we want to hire you for? Now, this is not because the company is so nice, and wonderful, and internalistic. It's because happy employees stay longer, do better work, and cause less trouble. >> Absolutely. >> So, they want you to be happy, maybe not giddy, but happy. Pleased you're there, because they get more out of you for longer. And it's a win-win. Cliche one that fits. The third thing, which is delayed think based upon a resume, a cover letter, and a few hours of interviewing that they like you. And it's really hard, this is kind of like, what's a conclusion in the first state? >> Mm-hm. >> Do they like you, do they want to spend more time with you? The way I phrased it was at 8 o'clock at night in the middle of the budget season when you're working 15 hours a day, is this somebody you want to be working with? If it is, it says, they can do whatever it is you're hiring to do, and you like being around them in a high-pressure situation. So, those three aspects, do they do the job, they think you're going to like doing the job, and they think they're going to like you, which means you'll fit the culture and personality, are the hiring criteria. And what that says, going back to resume, resumes are thought of as very dry, fact based. Well, what they also need to be is a communication of a persona. >> Mm-hm. >> You got to get a little facts, and a little personality in there. And the personality's gotta be done by others more than yourself. LinkedIn has this great list of ten words they put every year, which are the most BS words you've ever imagined. I mean, energetic, a go-getter, results oriented, world class. I mean, you can just imagine the list. >> Uh-huh. >> And they put out this list every year. And it really sad. So, you can't say it like that. What you can say is, I was selected. You show your promotions. >> Mm-hm. >> I was awarded. I was selected to be in this multi-divisional, or functional team that, those are good things. >> And they're very unique, and personal. >> Yeah. >> So, it showed that you were not just on a committee, or you were not just there at a particular time. >> Yep. >> But you actually engaged, and participated, and contributed something of meaning and value. >> Yeah, and those are wonderful thoughts, and as you get up, and even as a junior manager. You can say matter of fact, I had, two of my employees who were promoted. That speaks world of you because it's a 360 degree world that you're being analyzed in, and so if you have cross functional appears. If you have losses, and higher ups in other divisions who ask the, if I'm a marketer and I say that the CIO asks me to be marketing representative on the project. That's big time. >> Absolutely. >> So, show that you are respected and trusted, which is a different thought than liked, but a very good one. So, you have broad-based supporters within the company. And on the things, what I call the last line, it shouldn't be prime more than one. If you showed volunteer efforts, company like to see a little volunteering. They don't want to see somebody who's so committed that they're doing 20 hours a week volunteering, and don't have enough time to do their job. But they like to see that because at all ages and levels you learn skills, you learn teamwork in a different environment. >> Absolutely. Another great segue. So, a person has the resume, they've marketed themselves properly through the network, social media. They understand the interview process, looking at what the employer is trying to extrapolate from the interview. Now, they have the job, so now- >> [LAUGH] >> Their, now they're in the- >> Yes! >> Corporation, right? And so now, talk a little bit about the self-management because a lot of time where you you start in a corporation, is not your aspiration- >> Yep. >> You kind of want to go through promotions, and get to a maybe more senior position. So, there is a part of that self-management. You're managing your own career >> Absolutely. >> So could you speak to that a little bit? >> Well one of the things is trying to figure out what you want to be. I always say, I don't know what I want to be when I grow up, I'm still saying that, okay? I know it's got something to do with marketing, but other than that let's have fun. So, if you're in a job in a company, your first assessment really is, do I fit the company or not? Second, is within that company, what do I think I'm good at? A little but what I like, you don't even want to ever get in jobs that you dislike. I mean, you know, it's okay for a project. But not a long term job that you dislike or are unhappy with. >> Mm-hm. >> But if you're in a company you like and you're in a general area you like then you're trying to gain experiences. So you want to be the person who is known to be willing to take a risky next project. Because you have the support of the people around you, and you're a little bold, you have confidence that you'll find a way and they have confidence you can too. Now a good boss is going to give you enough rope so you can, you know, be a little dangerous, but not so much that you're going to fall off the edge of the world so to speak. >> Absolutely. >> And so look for those projects, look for projects that take you a little outside of your core area. Because when I say I like marketing, I was in advertising, branding, direct response, Internet, a lead generation, I mean, I've been all over the place. They all interconnect but they take very specific different skills, and when you're younger and earlier in your career, it helps you get more of those skills. There's always the argument and there's no answer to this but there is two paths, you can be the world's expert in. That's what I call the senior scientist role. You can also be a generalist, now I'm a generalist within marketing. I have some friends who, any subject I would take, or tackle any project, I have friends who are better in that subject, that sub-discipline than I am. And that's where I need to know who to bring in that goes to network, how to get them to work together well. >> Your resources, maximizing your resources. >> You got it. And that can be employees, or it can be consultants. It's better if it's employees in many ways. >> Mm-hm. >> But you've gotta, over time, you will end up in one of those two paths. At least most people do, and there's not one better or worse than the other. Not one that necessarily pays better than the other, it's just what are you best at? What do you enjoy the most? >> Mm-hm. >> I've met some people literally. Who should be left in a cubicle, never talked to, and paid a lot of money, okay? They can do what they can do better than anybody in the world and they love doing. >> And they're very productive. >> They're great! >> And efficient! >> Yeah, and I know other people Who and I'm this thing after a couple of years I start getting bored. I got to have another stimulus, so it's all different, and if you learn that about yourself, you'll move forward. The other thing you need to learn is what makes your boss happy, and that sounds kind of crass, but it's not. You're going to keep employed if you're doing the job you need to do because it is kind of a what I call a lightswitch and not a risk at he can do it or not. Now to get progression within that there's a couple things I always say and the first one is, by having you there is your boss more likely for him or her to continue being employed? Real simple concept, if you're causing trouble some place, if you're not getting the job done, you're less likely to be there because you're risking his or her job. The second thing, which is not, maybe equally important, it's a little softer view though is, are you making your boss's life easier. >> Mhm. >> And that can be, those things overlap is what cause them, but if you go over to IT and I use that a lot because marketing and IT have to work so closely together so then that way for about 20 years. In the future it's almost going to be one group, in many ways, except for the highly technical aspect of IT, but if your boss knows you can go on a project that has IT and somebody from the CFO's office on it. And their going to, as you walk in doors, say! There's John, this is going to be a good group, you know, we're going to get things done, with minimal hassles, that boss loves you, okay? If he says, I got to send John over, and last time he worked with IT, I mean, it, the project got done, but I got all this bad feedback. You prayed all along for that job. >> Right. >> And so think of that job, your boss keeps employed and their life is easier, now, if your boss is a small business owner or runs a P&L, it also helps if you making him money. Saving money is almost as good as making it, and by money, I mean profit, not just revenue. >> Right. >> So, that's a third measurement, price should be the first, but a lot of, a lot of jobs the profitability is more removed than in marketing and sales, what I focus on. >> All right, great, so we're talking about self-management and self-marketing within the corporation. I'm going to throw a scenario at you. >> All right. >> All right, so you're the senior executive VP of marketing and here's someone who has very great aspirations, and they get in the elevator with you. >> All right. >> And you have the ability to make things move. >> All right. >> Promotions and things of that nature, and here's someone who wants to do an elevator pitch. >> All right. >> Because that's actually an assignment that I have within the course. >> [LAUGH] I know it well. >> So there's two coins or two sides to this elevator pitch. >> All right. >> Number one is the things that you're looking for as the senior VP who can make the decisions. >> Yeah. >> And then the other side of the coin is what the individual, the students should be doing to prepare to have a successful elevator pitch. So let's take either side first and then we'll flip to the other side. >> Yeah. That's a toughy. >> [LAUGH] >> No, this is phrased differently than I've thought about much in the past, but we talk about elevator pitch so much but it's more in a finding a job. And I think that the smartest thing there from either side is something that's fact-based that's important to both people. And this is dangerous territory also, because you'd love to tell the senior person, I just did this on this project. However, your boss may be orchestrating making that communication in a week with fuller information, and taking more of the credit than he or she probably deserves. Alright. So it's dangerous to be, too out front with that, but what you, if I'm asking you, hey, what's going on, you, it'd be very easy to say, hey, I'm in this great project with, four or five different functions where we're working on the. You know the development of the new website or platform. And I'm the marketing representative or I am the controller on it, whatever. And this is a great project that has done very well. I'm betting you're going to be hearing the details of this soon. So you've said, I'm part of the team. I'm really doing, you know, having fun, it's going well, and you're going to be hearing about it soon, and so you haven't talked quote, unquote cliche out-of-school. >> All right, I like that. Now, let's take the other side where you did mention an elevator pitch- >> Yep. >> For someone who's looking to land the job. >> All right. >> And I like that side. >> All right. >> So speak to that. >> Well the, I think it's a about a three stage thing. And I use to, nobody knows the right length, but I always say 3 to 15 words. The other way to look at it is you can get on line. So if you can go the six seconds, think of that as a hook. And that gets all it's trying to do is some interest and get the general idea. Like the next stage could be 30 seconds or so. It just gives more information so it kind of submits the interest. Then, if there's interest, you can go on for let's say two minutes and then you follow in. But it's never a long conversation It's a exchange of information. So my background what I finally learned after I'd been hired for this once and then I got smart and used it the next two times was I rebuilt marketing organizations to quickly increase sales and profits. >> Very safe. >> So that's what I do. >> Uh-huh. >> And if you gotta deliver that much differently, tone of voice, to different people. Like if I'm at a Chamber of Commerce networking function, I price a, I run marketing department for and just at that, if there's any interest, then if I have somebody, and you could also say, if you have any marketing questions, I'd love to talk marketing. If you have anything I can help you with, please let me know. That goes into, there's a cliche now playing it forward and that just means being helpful. If you give information, if you give content, if you give value to somebody, you have just made a contact. If you say I, I'm looking for a job. Here's what I do. Do you know anything? You know, nobody should give you the time of day. >> Mm-hm. >> So provide that information. It could be you know, I'm using marketing examples but I'm a project manager. Several of our score counselors that have expertise. And I've just been running the most fascinating project probably of my whole career. And it's begging somebody to say, well what was that? And if they're not interested they walk off. You know you'll never have 100% hook. If you're fishing you don't get every fish you pull on I don't think. I don't fish. I don't know. >> [LAUGH] Those are great. So some take aways that I heard you say which are paramount Is concise. >> Yeah. >> Accurate, factual, and then able to have the ability to build upon on that, if needed. You start of with something very concise, factual, that gives informary information about yourself and your ability. One last thing that- >> Let me just add two things. One is personal. Personable. So it's a little bit, you've got some personality into it, it's not just hard fact. And the second thing is there's an expectation you're setting up or an easy response that somebody's coming back to you with. >> Great. One last thing and I'll wrap it up. This has been a great interview. I wanted to discuss a little bit about peer assessment. >> Okay. >> I think it's very critical, to have the skill and the ability to be able to give constructive feedback to your peers and be able to maintain a working relationship, a relationship that you can build upon very positively. So sometimes that feedback might not be something that a person really wants to hear, you know? But you have to have the ability, the creativity to be able to shape that feedback to where it's factual, truthful, and constructive. So the intent is to actually have you improve and still be able to maintain that relationship. >> Yep. >> Can you speak a little bit to that. >> Yeah, and obviously this is delicate area, important, or you wouldn't have brought it up. But if you think of it, the respect if you have a respect already build up it's easier to do this. >> Um-hm. >> The other thing I mention before it's a 360 world. So a lot of your ability to get things done and be successful or cause you to fail is your peers. >> Absolutely. >> In your same department or other departments okay either way. And when you're looking for networking contacts and all, your peers are going to be a good source as not just people who are more senior, more advanced in their career. So what I find is immediate is better than delayed. Praise, when praise is due. Allows you later to then mention some negatives. Or you can do a, a what I call a one two. And I don't mean one two punch. I mean, first is hey, you know this went really well, you know. [APPLAUSE] You know, we should get a, a gobs and celebrate this. And then, you know, but the one thing you and I could have done better. And if you say you and I instead of you, it's going to be helpful. And if it's combining something that is a flaw with something that went well, then you've got, I think, a more receptive audience. You can also say you know we were really lucky today. They could've killed us on this point and they didn't. We gotta protect ourselves next time. And you can approach it that way. But it starts with easier relationship. If you walk in some place and you have a bad relationship already of that person it's very difficult to give that negative feedback unless they report to you. So at that point you have to be even more so it's us not you and sometimes it was them. So you have to come across as honest though and at times there's no such thing as constructive criticism. It's like this didn't work. And, your bosses will get involved in some major problem and that honestly, at that point, is the best you can do. >> Absolutely. Well, thank you for your time. This is great. We'll post this into the course for self-management and self-marketing for the students to be able to extrapolate so many diamond nuggets- >> [LAUGH] >> In this conversation. Again, my name is Dr John Beckham, and I'm here with a personal friend of mine As senior VP, Executive of Marketing, Richard Salvors. Thank you. >> Thank you very much, Alph.
